New Housing

I was looking outside the ground from the promenade with a couple of other wrinkly’s yesterday, the conclusions we arrived at after much debate was (1) why the hell did we give up the tarmac right of way to the ground at the Theatre end of the ground. (2) The houses to be built in that ground looking at the slope will be Merthyr’s answer to Gren’s Aberflyarf in the Echo. (Excuse the spelling)

Twyn Jasper wrote:(1) why the hell did we give up the tarmac right of way to the ground at the Theatre end of the ground.  

All this was gone into at the meeting in January and was debated afterwards. We were told that path was not on land leased by the club, so was not the club's to give up.

It has always been ours and used when accessible for as long as anyone who does not have selective memory loss remembers!

When we returned to PP our lease of the ground only took us up to the fence at the Theatre Royal End.  The land behind belonged to the Council as does our ground but we hold the lease on our bit.  Therefore there is nothing we can do.  We did ask Merthyr Valley Homes who now either own or lease that land if we could retain the right of way but that was refused, so that's that.

I would have thought it would not be the valley homes decision if we can or rather the public can keep a right of way.The whole of heolgerrig mountain is full of debatable rights of way and is still ongoing with all parties still in negotiations about them.I am not sure if that area was a right of way though there was one around the ground and up the driveway in bygone days bearing in mind our former owner was the owner of heolgerrig mountain and he could not stop people using the right of ways only where public safety was involved

I think you'll find that its Wales & West Housing Association who are building these houses and not Merthyr Valleys Homes

Long in the Tooth wrote:I think you'll find that its Wales & West Housing Association who are building these houses and not Merthyr Valleys Homes

Whatever!

Well it is important. You said that, "we did approach Merthyr Valleys Homes who either own or lease the land". Obviously that was a waste of time since they have no involvement. If we want a positive response then we need to speak to Wales & West HA

Long in the Tooth wrote:Well it is important.  You said that, "we did approach Merthyr Valleys Homes who either own or lease the land".  Obviously that was a waste of time since they have no involvement.  If we want a positive response then we need to speak to Wales & West HA

That was done by our Board Secretary.  I just got the wrong Housing Association in my post.

why the hell did we give up the tarmac right of way to the ground at the Theatre end of the ground

The tarmac path from Pontmorlais to the theatre end of the ground has not been on the land included in the lease granted to our Society, although previous leases included it.

When I became aware of the Wales and West Building Society plan to develop that land I asked them if the would be retaining the path and they said no.

We have contacted the Merthyr Council Dept responsible for Rights of Way and they have confirmed according to their records the path is not a registered legal Right of Way.

John Strand

Could or would this cause a problem in the not to distant future, should be lucky enough to eventually get promotion to the Conference Premier Division? I believe under their ground grading criteria, it states that a club should have 8 turn-styles with some of these allocated for visiting fans, giving access to a segregated area! Would we be able to achieve this without the Theatre Entrance?

I know that some supporters believe that the Conference Premier Division is wishful thinking, but ultimately I would hope that this would be the ambition of the majority.

Martyr Weaver wrote:Could or would this cause a problem in the not to distant future, should be lucky enough to eventually get promotion to the Conference Premier Division? I believe under their ground grading criteria, it states that a club should have 8 turn-styles with some of these allocated for visiting fans, giving access to a segregated area! Would we be able to achieve this without the Theatre Entrance?  

Others will know more about this, but I don't see why there should be any problem. What we have to remember is that after the new development is completed the turnstiles won't be where they are now, so it won't be a case of those and no others. As far as I understand the plans there won't just be one set of turnstiles giving access to the whole site as at present. I would guess that segregation of one end, or part of one end, could be achieved.

Martyr Weaver wrote:Could or would this cause a problem in the not to distant future, should be lucky enough to eventually get promotion to the Conference Premier Division? I believe under their ground grading criteria, it states that a club should have 8 turn-styles with some of these allocated for visiting fans, giving access to a segregated area! Would we be able to achieve this without the Theatre Entrance?  

I know that some supporters believe that the Conference Premier Division is wishful thinking, but ultimately I would hope that this would be the ambition of the majority.

Yes Martyr Weaver I think you have a valid point; It would also be interesting to know what would be the official ground capacity if ever we do reach the heady heights?

I believe the issue was addressed by the Architect , Mr Stuckey at the recent meeting.

The loss of a licence to use the Theatre End Access is a small price to pay for the improvement and renovation works to our Community Club that are underway...I do not believe we ever had a recorded legal easement or a Prescriptive Easement (usage without consent for over 20 years) bearing in mind the Club or its predecessors in title have only ever had a LEASEHOLD interest in the stadium and pitch area in any event.

I believe Mr Stuckey said the main entrance will be two way- ingress and egress....it will be safer for pedestrians and car users too..

Should we exceed our expectations and climb the leagues further, I am happy to have a sustainable 'very vibrant' community facility not located in Taff's Well....and that isn't a slight on our former hosts - as without their aid we would NOT have a club.

The rest they say is history.

Except that is.. our Trust Board and Council have MADE history happen.

We owe them a great debt.

Boz

In the public meeting regarding the ground re-development a question was asked regarding the Conference & I recollect the reply was that the new facilities should enable us to meet Conference Standards.

I would respectfully suggest that it if anyone has any concerns/queries then they should attend and ask the relevant questions in the next meeting which according to the last newsletter will be held shortly to update supporters on the development and to explain the delay in commencement of the project.

I have great faith in our Trust Board who have done an excellent job in conjunction with Merthyr Council in obtaining the grant to ensure we have this excellent Community Facility at PP and they should both be applauded for their hard working in bringing this to fruition.

Boz1964 wrote:
I believe Mr Stuckey said the main entrance will be two way- ingress and egress....
Boz

Just to emphasise the point I was making in my earlier post - the existing turnstiles are at the main entrance to the site, but they won't be there after the work is carried out.

As I understand it, in future you will go through the entrance to the SITE and then gain admittance to the GROUND through new turnstiles which won't all be in one place.

This point was covered in the January newsletter in the Q&A session =

http://www.pitchero.com/clubs/merthyrtown/news/januarys-newsletter-available-1360615.html

Thank you both Imp and OS for clearing that up...I hope the fans on the forum can see that the Architect has that one covered.

All we need to do as fans is get behind the team on Saturday.

And of course spread the word that Merthyr is the footballing capital of the Valleys.

Boz

In response to Twyn Jasper, the ground capacity for the Conference Premier is 5,000; PP would easily comply with that, once the Terrace at the Theatre end is refurbished; it already meets the other requirements for covered seating and standing areas. There are many other criteria such as parking for visitor fans and directors which the proposed ground improvement will cover. The only facility that I was puzzled about was the 8 turnstiles with visiting fans using a segregated entrance to a segregated area; but as this has been covered then I look forward to the day when we return to the Conference!

Going back the the loss of an entrance, I recall when I was young, there were also single gates in the corner at the Park Chapel end, and also out onto the lane behind Park Terrace; Attendances in the Pre and Post War years, (pre-television) were obviously much larger then; I don't think that the residents of those areas would be very happy if these entrances still existed!

There is no real possibility of trying to claim an Easement by prescription. The right only exists if the claimant can show (inter alia) an uninterrupted right of user for the period. In this case, there was certainly a fairly big interruption - and, of course, even if that wasn't the case, the club isn't the same club whose members used the passageway in the 1980's onward.

Other rights of way can be acquired when used by the general public over a course of time. However, that wouldn't work here either as if my memory is correct, the ground end of the footpath doesn't go anywhere except a turnstile which didn't provide access 98% of the time, and the other 2% only provided access on payment of a fee (the entrance fee).